Radio Interview
Interviewed by Brian Mason
WLAC Nashville, TN October 1987
Brian Mason: Before I forget, we need to say good morning to Ken and Vicky and Vicky...
Rich Mullins: Hello Ken and Vicky, my favorite neighbors
Brian Mason: Where would he be now on its route... his paper route?
Rich Mullins: Probably on bear waller road.
Brian Mason: Probably there. Ken - drive carefully. Alright let's play this song now. Why do your songs always sound like incomplete sentences?
Rich Mullins: You mean my song titles?
Brian Mason: Song titles, yeah
Rich Mullins: um, I don't know because I generally take like the first line of the chorus or the first line of the the song or ...
Brian Mason: "When You Love"
Rich Mullins: That's one of my favorites
Brian Mason: I like that too. "Be With You."
Rich Mullins: yeah, ooh I love that one.
Brian Mason: Yeah, but this one is called "It Don't Do."
Rich Mullins: It don't do to write titles that sound like incomplete sentences. My English teachers used to tell me the same thing. They always said your entire paragraph sounds like an incomplete sentence. (Laughter) So then I refined that to just making titles sound incomplete.
Brian Mason: Alright. What does the song mean?
Rich Mullins: It means it don't do to preach the gospel if you don't live the Christian life.
Brian Mason: Okay it's there - yeah, it's very pointed yeah in that direction.
Rich Mullins: So yeah, cuz I'm a little bit ticked off with people.
Brian Mason: Are you really?
Rich Mullins: yeah
Brian Mason: because you feel like they've got a platform and they're abusing it?
Rich Mullins: I just feel like there should be a difference between the way Christians live and the way pagans live. You know and I'm not so sure that people in the world can make that distinction because I'm not so sure the people we have in leadership in the church are distinct. And I think you know they should be above reproach and all that and I'm not always sure that they are I'm not always sure that I am. So it's kind of like I was a little aggravated with myself too because I'm going, gee you know what if you didn't get paid to do this? Would people still think you're a Christian? and I was kind of like well I know I'm a nice guy but, you know, so is a lot of people...
Brian Mason: Alright so that's what you're addressing in this song?
Rich Mullins: Yeah.
Brian Mason: Okay, we've got got several songs yet on the album to play and running out of time, so we want to kind of move quickly here. Three songs that we have to play - there's just no doubt about it.
(Loud boom)
Rich Mullins: Does that make noise?
Brian Mason: That made a great... the springs are loaded here.
Rich Mullins: Sorry - I'm sorry about that but it's time for you to get up and go to church.
Brian Mason: It is live radio too, so it doesn't make any difference. "Be With You" you said had a good story?
Rich Mullins: Oh yeah, this has a great story.
Brian Mason: Alright. What is the story Rich?
Rich Mullins: Okay, I borrowed a friend of mine's car and drove it to my parents house in Indiana and I had to take his car back to him and he lives in Knoxville. In fact four of the songs on this album were written on my way to to Knoxville and this song I was driving through the mountains and thinking about what they would look like after the war... after the bomb... after the nuclear bomb. Because you figure it's inevitable. I mean there are enough idiots in office in enough countries that it's bound to
happen and I was really feeling angry because I thought, you know ,it's not fair that they have - I understand why people get killed because people screw up things, but trees don't screw anything up and mountains don't screw anything up and there are a lot of things out there in the world that are just beautiful and they exist for no reason except just to be beautiful. And I thought, gee it's just not fair that they should all be destroyed - that they should all be ruined. So that's when I thought of the line - well, then I realized, well God's gonna destroy it anyway, you know? And it would be more fun for Him to do it than for us to do it because He's gonna do a better job of it. And then He's going to remake everything. Make everything new without all the defects that people brought into it and so that's when I just started
praying and I said 'then when you blast the cosmos to kingdom come,' and then I went 'oh man, I'm gonna stop praying now I'm gonna write a song.' And then I couldn't get it finished so I had to come back to Nashville and another friend of mine that I really like Justin Peters, that I think is a real good writer, and and I was playing it for him and he just kind of helped me finish the song up. Came in with some real key phrases that that pulled it all together for us.
Brian Mason: This is a good album Pictures In The Sky. Where did the title come from?
Rich Mullins: Um, the title song...
Brian Mason: Yeah, well the title song and...
Rich Mullins: Oh! Where did the the title song come from?
Brian Mason: Yeah and just the idea of Pictures In The Sky...
Rich Mullins: Well, my car broke down - well it hadn't really broken down...
Brian Mason: Dude, you and your cars!
Rich Mullins: Yeah, really. It was uh... but I had to take it in for repairs and a friend of mine Dave McCracken dropped me off at the place and then left me - abandoned
me and gave me two tickets to Barbara Mandrell country.
Brian Mason: Yeah?
Rich Mullins: ... and we took it to the garage - this garage right down on Broadway - and Broadway, incidentally, I wrote this song in the exact same place
that I wrote the song in my last album that was called, the one that ...
Brian Mason: "These Days?"
Rich Mullins: "These Days." Yeah., Pam Hall and I wrote. Anyway, so there I was on Broadway - on lower Broad even and a really depressed area and I was walking around it was just a real cloudy day and I thought you know it looks so much nicer out there than it does down here and and so I walked up to Barbara Mandrell country with my free ticket and Dave was already up there and and I said, 'hey what do you think of this?' And I sang him a couple lines and he really liked it so I finished it.
Brian Mason: That's good. I want to play "Screen Door" now
Rich Mullins: Okay.
Brian Mason: I like this. I mean this is just nothing but fun - pure fun. It's real short too - who's in the studio with you here? Chris Harris?
Rich Mullins: Chris Harris...
Brian Mason: I hear him in almost just an instant.
Rich Mullins: ...and Chris Rodriguez and Wayne Kirkpatrick.
Brian Mason: Just the four of you?
Rich Mullins: Uh-huh.
Brian Mason: Okay a little goofing off in the very beginning and...
Rich Mullins: A lot of goofing off but just a little of it is on tape.
Brian Mason: So we get off to kind of a slow start here but then the song takes off. A good message in this thing - it's not just a fun song, it's a good message.
Rich Mullins: A heavy message.
Brian Mason: Explain the message just real briefly.
Rich Mullins: The message is that you have to do something about what you believe in or you have to stop saying that you believe in it.
Brian Mason: It's short and sweet to the point, but it's good. this is called "Screen Door" from Rich Mullins.
["Screen Door"]
Brian Mason: Now you write some stuff with Pam Mark Hall and she thinks highly of you in terms of who she likes to write with...
Rich Mullins: I think she's great.
Brian Mason: You guys seem to get along real well. You write with some other people, it says it in here. You talked about Justin Peters a little while ago and Wayne Kirkpatrick but you write a lot by yourself. Is there a certain amount of inspiration that you have to be hit with, I mean we're...
Rich Mullins: Normally trouble.
Brian Mason: Its trouble? It makes you write songs?
Rich Mullins: Yeah, I wrote that song because I got a real bad hankering to do something I knew I shouldn't and just in order to concentrate on something else - to get my mind off of what it was that I wanted to do, I said okay I'm gonna write - well originally I started out to write a limerick. I was gonna write a limerick. But it didn't work out as a limerick very well. But it did turn into a nice song I think.
Brian Mason: Was it um.. it was intended to be an acapella type Street...
Rich Mullins: No originally it was just gonna be like, like...
Brian Mason: A verse?
Rich Mullins: Yeah and then like I think the more of yourself that you involve in whatever you're doing when you're trying to distract yourself the better. So I started singing. I was in my car, I was on my way to Knoxville again. I was in Chattanooga, of all places. I mean whatever in the world I wanted to do that wasn't good, I can't imagine wanting to do it in Chattanooga ,you know? Yeah I get real inspired by anger and I shouldn't be so much. I enjoy it a little much...
Brian Mason: Really?
Rich Mullins: Eell if I enjoyed it a little less then I'd have more right to really be angry. Like, I like what Chesterton says. He says that the
pessimist isn't bad because he criticizes the world, but because he doesn't love what he criticizes. And I think if I loved more, I would have more right to criticize. But most people who love more don't criticize as much... because they're too busy trying to help things out to just be.. you know, unconstructive.
Brian Mason: Right. Set up "Verge of a Miracle" for me. I like this song.
Rich Mullins: Well this um... it was written because I do a lot of retreats. I work with with a lot of church groups and like that and just had talked to a kid who had attempted suicide and I was thinking that that was a bad thing to do. And the people who do it, don't do it for no reason and I thought maybe if I could reach out a little bit and say there is a reason not to, maybe it would help him. And the music was already written. I started the music at Hummingbird Studio when we started the album and then I worked a lot on it in Chicago when I was up there. This is like one of those songs that got inspired just out of real compassion for someone.
["Verge of a Miracle"]
Brian Mason (talking to Gary Chapman on the phone): Something else you did that was very unique last night when you introduced Rich Mullins.
Gary Chapman: I'm sorry Rich.. I went over the edge and I apologized.
Rich Mullins: Oh no, I liked it!
Gary Chapman: I don't think you would have been an axe murderer if you were not a Christian music...
Brian Mason: Tell what you said. Tell our listening audience.
Gary Chapman: I'm not sure I remember... the reason that stuff works is because I don't think about it.
Brian Mason: (Laughter) ...and you can repent an ask for forgiveness later.
Gary Chapman: Yeah. No, it was something to the effect of you know I don't know about you guys but I still have enough fear in my heart that I struggle sometimes with being completely honest. Sometimes I get caught trying to say what I think you want to hear instead of what I really believe. And this, our next guest, does not suffer under that particular malady.
Rich Mullins: I laughed last night too just like I did right then. It just came out.
Gary Chapman: That was good wasn't it?
Rich Mullins: it was very good.
Gary Chapman: I had to recall.
Rich Mullins: You did it word for word and it has scarred me so deeply that I will never forget it.
Gary Chapman: ...and then that I thank God that he's a Christian because if he wasn't he'd probably be an ax murderer.
Brian Mason: That's a sweet thing to say a spiritual moment that was and of course rich said the pays better being a Christian artist.
Rich Mullins: Not a lot better, but... that was an exaggeration, but you know when you're doing a concert the truth sometimes is bigger than facts.
Brian Mason: This is true....
Rich Mullins: I was talking in a spiritual sense.
Gary Chapman: Oh, Absolutely.
Rich Mullins: I do that all the time.
Gary Chapman: As you normally do.
Brian Mason: We did understand that. Well Mr. Chapman, we wish you were here this morning...
Gary Chapman: You know I wish I was. I planned on it but I kind of woke up in domestic madness. For the time I got the baby's diaper changed and I put on her new depends for the day it was the morning was gone.
